Raymond William Herbert WILLETT

Interviewer: Morag Forrester

Date of Interview: 18 August 2009

Track 1

00.00: Born RAYMOND WILLIAM HERBERT WILLETT in LONDON in 1936, his FATHER was named EDWARD SAMUEL SCHOOLING WILLETT whose occupation was JOINER by trade.

00.3-: Continues that his MOTHER was CATHERINE MARY COLLINS and his two BROTHERS are PATRICK (elder) and CHRISTOPHER (younger). Another BROTHER was born but died in infancy.

01.45: Briefly implies that theirs was not the happiest of families, blaming his MOTHER and suggests that was the reason all three BOYS left home as soon as they were able.

02.15: Replies that he went to ROXBOURNE PRIMARY SCHOOL in LONDON and recalls how (during WWII) there were armed guards on the building's flat roof ready to launch a defensive against attack from GERMAN air raid bombers.

02.30: He went onto EASTCOTE LANE SECONDARY SCHOOL and although he passed written exams for acceptance to grammar school, he was turned down on interview because of his attire which included a "hand-painted tie". But he later went to a TECHNICAL SCHOOL which focused on trades-related skills.

03.30: His first memory as a child growing up in LONDON during WWII was hearing the air raid siren. "I'd've been three and I was in the back garden with my

DAD.. .and I can still hear that sound.. .that was the first air raid siren warning us there could be bombs droppin'. "

04.20: Describes other occasions when the reality of WWII was made tangible to him and other civilians. Recalls seeking shelter "under the kitchen table" or at the communal neighbourhood air raid shelter made of concrete. "We seldom used them. "

05.35: Recalls other circumstances such as food shortages and ration books. "Each family member had a ration book. "

08.00: Referring back to his schooling, he mentions that NORTHERN POLYTECHNIC involved his travelling some distance from home to get there on the LONDON TUBE. Says the 1888 original school building was near the HOLLOWAY WOMEN'S PRISON. New premises meant the school was relocated to ST PANCRAS area and it was renamed ST. MAGNUS SCHOOL for BOYS.

09.00: Admits that during his last year at the SCHOOL, he was hardly ever there. "I just used to walk in, sign the register, say 'yes', and walk out... and go and have fun at the museums, HYDE PARK, LYONS CORNER HOUSE, buy some WOODBINES (cigarettes) and puff away."

10.30: Says he left school at the age of fifteen without any academic qualifications. "I left because on one of those hooky days I was going down PALL MALL with a mate.. .and I looked to the left and there's this sign on the window and it said 'Come to NEW ZEALAND'".

11.45: The poster was about a NZ-government scheme to attract young eligible workers to the country under an assisted package deal. Says that both his PARENTS signed the necessary paperwork allowing him to leave for NZ, his friend was not so fortunate.

12.45: It was more than a year later, he continues, that he set sail for NZ because he waited until his FATHER recovered from a serious illness and subsequent operation. But two years after landing in NZ, he received a telegram informing that his FATI-ŒR had died.

13.30: Considers that it was his FATHER'S difficult relationship with his MOTHER that probably caused the illness (related to high blood pressure). Adds that his FATHER fully supported his plans to emigrate and live in NEW ZEALAND.

14.00: "It's something I was always thankful for, that they allowed me to leave."

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00.02: Explains that the reason NZ offered the CHILD IMMIGRATION SCHEME was because post-war there was not a large enough workforce, in particular for planned infrastructure projects. About 540 UK-born youths aged between fifteen and seventeen years came out, he says.

01.00: "But surprisingly.. .there were ten and eleven year olds in the group, some of them orphans."

01.40: Although he told the authorities that he wanted to become a farmer in NZ, he says they tried to persuade him to follow a different occupation, such as a trade. It was undoubtedly because they were aware of the long hours expected of farm workers compared to other labour, he adds. Still, he was finally billeted to a farming family in the DARGAVILLE area of NORTHLAND.

0305: He arrived in WELLINGTON "two days off my seventeenth birthday" after a journey of "four weeks, three days" via PANAMA and passing by the PITCAIRN ISLANDS. He talks about some of the events on board ship.

07.10: His first impression of WELLINGTON HARBOUR, he recalls, was the ''kaleidoscope" of lights. "I was on deck very early in the morning and as the dawn broke, the colour of all the houses... but beyond that were these hills... to me they were mountains.. .1 was so excited."

08.55: Insists that he'd had no preconceived idea of the country he was moving to and although he'd not been apprehensive, he admits owning a photograph of his family being the last ones standing on the dockside to farewell the ship (HMS RANGITATA) as it pulled out of TILBURY, ENGLAND. "I don't think it had dawned on me that it was really happening."

09.50: On arrival at WELLINGTON on 9 SEPTEMBER 1953, the youths were met by a government child welfare officer. "MR JAMIESON, I think his name was... and we caught the express to AUCKLAND." Describes the journey and says that on reaching AUCKLAND, he travelled by bus to WHANGAREI where he met his guardians, JOE and MERLE (BURNSIDE) and their fourteen-year old daughter, BARBARA.

12-30: Remembers the hour-long, 30-mile journey from WHANGAREI to TANGOWAHINE (near DARGAVILLE) especially since it was the first time he'd experienced travelling on a "metal" road — "corrugations, potholes, dust".

13.30: Early the next day, it was straight to work on the FARM. "I'd never been close to a COW and I didn't know they were placid... it took me a while to realise they were all pets and had names and wouldn't hurt you." The herd, he adds, numbered about sixty JERSEY COWS.

14-30: A nearby creamery was supplied with the milk which was extracted by machine, he says, while the curds and whey were kept as pig feed for the FARM'S swine herd.

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00.00: Continues description of life on the FARM and compares it with the circumstances of post-war BRITAIN where rationing was still in place in 1953. For example, butter was limited to 2oz/week for each person in LONDON yet "I was putting that amount on my toast every morning" in NZ.

01.50: Another early memory of NZ is how after lunching on cold mutton and tomatoes, his jaw muscles ached from the act of chewing because he was so unused to eating plentiful supplies of meat.

02.30: Replies that he was paid £3. IOs ($7) a week as a farm worker. He was expected to work seven days with Sundays off between milkings (morning and evening). But as one of the family, he says, the BURNSIDES showed more leniency so he often joined JOE on fishing trips and other excursions.

03.20: "It was a good start for me. I enjoyed it tremendously."

04.30: It was not all plain sailing, however, in that it took a while for him to be accepted by the BURNSIDE'S neighbours and wider community. He explains that it was mainly due to past experience of the BURNSIDES taking in NZ-born CHILD WELFARE youths.

05.00: But within a few months attitudes changed and "suddenly it just opened up, I was here, there and everywhere".

06-20: Describes his first visit to NINETY MILE BEACH and his first taste of TOHEROA (shellfish). "We were allowed (to catch) fifty a day then. Now, none."

08.10: Again, he compares the difference between a populated beach on the ENGLISH south coast with what he experienced on the NORTH ISLAND west coast.

09.00: Replies that he lived on the FARM for two years and moved with the BURNSIDES to AUCKLAND. In the interim, he helped out on the FARM while living in AUCKLAND. He travelled between the city and the FARM on his first vehicle, a BSA BANTAM motorcycle for which he paid ten pounds. "It was totally absolutely stuffed, but it still went."

11.25: Although he was living in the city, he says he continued doing FARM labour. His next employer was HUGH LAMBIE who owned a couple of DAIRY FARMS at MANGARE which were run by managers.

12.00: "I used to navigate by the light over ONE TREE HILL and go and bring the COWS in." The milking was done at 4am and late in the afternoon every day.

13.05: Most of the milk and its by-products, he says, were exported to the UK.

14-25: States that he spent a couple of years living in AUCKLAND and mentions that (at the age of eighteen) he was billeted for CONPULSORY MILITARY TRAINING (CMT).

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00.00: Opens with story about doing some extra work for the LAMBIES.

01.45: Replies that he undertook CMT at PAPAKURA CAMP in AUCKLAND for the standard fourteen weeks. "They put me in the artillery, the gunners." Adds that he thrived on the discipline of a military life.

02.40: Suggests that in some ways it was easier than working on a dairy farm. "I went from four o'clock starts with one day off between milkings to six o'clock starts and every weekend... off."

03.30: Says those fourteen weeks at CAMP were followed by a further three weeks a year for the next three years. The last posting, he adds, was at the military CAMP near LAKE TEKAPO because by then he had moved to the SOUTH ISLAND.

07.10: Admits that although he enjoyed his stint of CMT, it was not suited to everyone, particularly those who flouted authority. "I can remember a couple of them were sent to the military prison at ARDMORE...they came back transformed. "

09.20: Replies that he still received a weekly wage during the training at a rate of about eleven shillings a day.

0930: Once the fourteen weeks were over, he went ahead with plans to tour the country on a FRANCIS BARNETT (motorcycle) which he bought through a trade-in deal with the BANTAM for £199.

13.10: Adds that he made up the difference in price by hire purchase but managed to pay off the debt within six weeks out of wages earned at the FREEZING WORKS at ONEHUNGA, AUCKLAND. "I went from seven pounds a week... to twenty-six pounds a week."

12.00. His tour lasted two and a half weeks travelling from AUCKLAND down the west coast of the NORTH ISLAND to WELLINGTON, across COOK STRAIT to NELSON then on through ARTHUR'S PASS to CHRISTCHURCH and further south through TEKAPO to GORE, MOSSBURN, TE ANAU until he reached the MARIAN HILL on SH94 where the road was closed to MILFORD SOUND due to weather conditions.

13.10: Adds that he was allowed to continue his journey through to MILFORD by the road works gang (the BROWN BROS). "It was empty. I only saw four horses, which I didn't know were the MILFORD (TRACK) horses. And there was an abandoned MINISTRY of (PUBLIC) WORKS road builders' camp, a row of huts."

13.50: Goes on to say he slept overnight in one of the tidier huts and the following morning was making his way back out of the settlement when he discovered the chain on the motorbike was slipping. So on all the steep inclines all the way to INVERCARGILL, he had to get off and push the bike.

14-20: In the city, he took the bike to TAPPER'S (HARDWARE) STORE which didn't have a replacement part but moulded a sprocket to fit. This, he says, managed to get and the bike back to AUCKLAND.

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00.00: Remembers it was QUEENSTOWN that had an immediate effect on him during his tour and he pitched tent at the MOTOR CAMP there for five days. In that time he went sight-seeing through SKIPPER'S CANYON and on the MV EARNSLAW across LAKE WAKATIPU.

02 30: Journeying on through MOSSBURN, he recalls the gravel road and dust and says it was a real wilderness (in 1956 much of the hinterland around MOSSBURN and in the TE ANAU BASIN was still uncultivated RUN country.).

04.00: Reaching TE ANAU, he says he stayed at its MOTOR CAMP (then run by the NZÅA) and bought groceries in the FOUR SQUARE (supermarket) where he informed the proprietor, MILDRED SHELTON, his immediate ambition was to make plans to return to the town on a permanent basis.

05.15: It was the mountains in FIORDLAND that instantly appealed to him, he says. "As I got down here and saw all this, I thought 'oh wow'... yeah, I was hooked.'

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00.15: On returning to AUCKLAND, he says he left the FREEZING WORKS to take up a job at HENDERSON POLLARD'S JOINERY FACTORY. He also mentions that he continued an earlier volunteer position with a SCOUT GROUP in ONEHUNGA.

01.45: His next job was CAVE GUIDE at the WAITOMO CAVES, in the WAIKATODISTRICT. "Never done anything like it in me life."

02-35: Says the job involved taking visitor groups through the three caves several times a day. "Took to it like a duck to water."

03.20: Staff quarters were provided, he explains, by the TOURIST HOTEL CORPORATION (THC), a government agency which owned and operated all the tourist HOTELS in the more remote areas of NEW ZEALAND, because they were then unprofitable for private enterprise.

04.10. States that many of the male staff employed by the THC at that time were "POMMY ship jumpers". Domestic staff, he adds, included mainly local MAORI women while reception and wait staff were usually young AUSTRALIAN women on working holidays.

05-30: Affirms that there was plenty of social activity among the staff such as going to the movies or the beach. Mentions that a lifelong friend made during that spell at WAITOMO was the celebrated author and poet, KEVIN IRELAND

08.00: Says there was little emphasis on the "physical side" between couples out on a date. "You had wonderful relationships, but not sexual...not till later (when he was working at the CHATEAU [1958] near LAKE TAUPO)"

08 35: During the fifteen months at WAITOMO, he says he discovered that the THC also owned and operated the MILFORD TRACK so he wrote a letter of interest in working there as a GUIDE.

09.00: The manager at WAITOMO, GEORGE MULDER, he says, helped him secure a job on the MILFORD TRACK on condition that he work there during the summer season and at the CHATEAU during its winter season. "What a win-win."

10.45: His job on the MILFORD TRACK was titled TRACKMAN/GUIDE which involved maintaining the TRACK, meeting new arrivals at SIX-MILE HUT, or GUIDING people through the MACKINNON PASS from POMPOLONA HUT where they met up with the GUIDES stationed at QUINTIN HUT. "So we only knew the people for twenty-four hours."

11.55: Replies that it was the first POMPOLONA HUT (since replaced with an upgrade) and it had a 20-bed bunk room for women, which led onto the dining room and kitchen at the back of which was a small room for the HUT WARDEN and his wife.

12.30: Continues that there was a separate building which housed one each of an 8-bunk and a 12-bunk room. The latter was additional women's quarters and the former was for any men that preferred the HUT accommodation. Comments that in those days most NZ men who spent time in the bush ridiculed the idea of spending the night in a HUT.

13.00: Most of the people he catered for at POMPOLONA, he says, were young women and many of those were AUSTRALIANS on a working holiday. He adds that within weeks he had learned a lot about assessing likely contenders for assistance along the upward stretch to the PASS.

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01.00: Replies that in 1958 the season opened in the first week of DECEMBER and closed in the second week of APRIL the following year. In recent years, the season begins almost a month earlier, depending on weather conditions and the risk of avalanche.

01.35: For the 1958/59 season, the number of visitors on the TRACK totalled 1 170, and seven seasons later it had risen to 2545.

02.05: Compared with present day figures, he says, it's not much but the facilities were also fewer then. There was a staff of three at POMPOLONA with one extra during the peak times: there was no refrigeration for supplies, no washing machines or other appliances.

02.30: In the 2000s, he continues, there are about ten staff, walk-in freezers, washing machines and driers so that it's easier working there. "We'd chop a tree down to cook the meals on, boil the towels and pillow-slips up on the copper."

03.00: Adds that helicopters have replaced PACKHORSES for delivering supplies of food and equipment. Mentions that someone was employed to look after the HORSES until by 1963 a tractor road was built aimed at replacing the animals ''which were struggling to keep up with the increasing numbers".

03.45: From SEPTEMBER, he says, staff began bringing in supplies for the season ahead and as the tractor road progressed to three and three-quarter miles up the CLINTON VALLEY, the horses were re-housed at POMPOLONA.

04.30: "The tractor and trailer would come up the valley, we would go down with the HORSES, boil the billy for the TRAMPERS at the SIX-MILE HUT, send them on their way, continue down the valley to meet the tractor and trailer, load it up, up to POMPOLONA. It meant that pre-season, we could do eight PACKHORSE trips a day."

05.00: Says that by the time he left the job completely, the tractor road had reached the SIX-MILE HUT. But in the late 1960s, the entire road was washed away following severe flooding. By then, helicopters had arrived, he adds.

05.50: In 1958, as a GUIDE on the MILFORD TRACK his wage was about eleven pounds a fortnight, with accommodation etc provided. And although the work was officially seven days a week, there was enough spare time outside of the peak season to allow staff to enjoy the benefits of their surroundings.

07.00: At POMPOLONA, he says there was a staff of five, including the PACKMAN, and they all mucked in together with the chores. They included RAY and SHIRLEY COTTLE, NORMA (SHIRLEY'S sister) and her infant son, BRIAN COMPTON.

08.15: The TRACK maintenance meant cutting back the native ferns, fixing the creek beds after any major flooding and cutting down beech trees from which they made bridges. "Now, of course, the bridges are flown in.. -all pre-built." On wet days he created sign boards.

09.30: The Fiordland National Park (FNP) had just been formed (c. 1953) but he says there was little interaction between the FNP BOARD and the TRACK staff. There was one PARK RANGER, PHIL DORIZAC, but no FNP hut system (now managed by its successor, the DEPARTMENT of CONSERVATION (DOC).

09.45: Goes on to say that a freedom-walker hut system was created following protests to the OMBUDSMAN from the OTAGO UNIVERSITY TRAMPING CLUB (and possibly the NZ ALPINE CLUB).

10.45: Attributes the lack of détente to the frosty relationship between the MANAGER of the THC in TE ANAU and the FNP CHIEF RANGER (neither ofwhom he names) allegedly after he'd been evicted from the HOTEL bar due to offensive behaviour.

12 00: At first the FNP HUT system was open house but eventually, he says, the increasing attraction of the "world-famous" MILFORD TRACK led to disaster with over-crowding. In the end, the two groups combined to create a booking system for walking the TRACK.

12-30: "The only difference now is that one costs a couple of thousand because of the hot showers and the wine and everything else, and the other one is a few hundred. You get the same experience, same weather, same TRACK, same everything.'

12.50: In 1958, he replies, it cost twenty-eight pounds for the GUIDED WALK.

13.30: Referring to the maintenance work he did in the late 50s and early 60s, he reiterates that the small bridges were made from cut down beech trees. Goes on to describe building "HELEN'S BRIDGE" in 1960 and that he only recently saw a welded steel replacement for it being made at the DOC workshop in TE ANAU.

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00.00: Explains that he met his WIFE, HELEN (née SHEPHERD) at the CHATEAU in the TONGARIRO NATIONAL PARK (near LAKE TA UPO). She had just returned from three years’ work in ENGLAND, he adds. Her family came from HASTINGS, NAPIER.

01.00: Trained as a NURSE, he says HELEN had taken time out to do a working holiday back home in NZ and opted to join the mountain staff at the CHATEAU. He recalls their first meeting was at the boot and ski counter where he made a jibe about the size of her feet.

01.45: Their next encounter was even less auspicious having turned from his playing mischief on some colleagues into a potentially embarrassing meeting as he emerged from a wardrobe. "I remember that... she'll remember that (laughs)."

02.40: At the end of the season, he says, HELEN went to AUSTRALIA to work. On returning once more to NZ, she travelled south from AUCKLAND on a motor scooter "a Puch" and worked at the THC HOTEL in TE ANAU.

03.15: Says that HELEN has worked at various jobs over the years, such as a GUIDE at the GLOW-WORM CAVES (on LAKE TE ANAU), at the PHARMACY, the POST OFFICE, at GLADE HOUSE (on the MILFORD TRACK) and was the first NURSE for the volunteer ambulance service.

03.45: Her stint at GLADE HOUSE, he adds, coincided with his at nearby POMPOLONA HUT and on her evenings off, she would walk through the TRACK to the HUT even after dusk.

04.30: States they got MARRIED after he was appointed as an FNP RANGER. The ceremony (on 16 JULY 1963) was held at LAKE TAUPO after they got special dispensation from the local church authorities.

05.50: Recalls it was raining heavily that day and that he was icing the wedding cake only moments before the ceremony was due to start. "I can remember the bride and groom on the cake (had) gone on the list (sideways) 'cause the icing was still soft (laughs)."

06.30: Mentions that afterwards they called in on the TOKANU HOTEL (T" UPO) where his friend GEORGE MULDER was manager. He provided them with the HOTEL'S honeymoon suite. They continued their journey back to TE ANAU where he was due to start his new job.

08-05: Talks about his BROTHER (PAT) and the development of his decision also to move to NEW ZEALAND with his wife and family. Mentions that PAT'S job in the UK was building HAWKER HUNTER JET aircraft.

10-55: Describes attending the interview for the FNP job which was held (at the INTERNAL AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT offices) in INVERCARGILL. Convinced that he'd flunked it, he arrived in AUCKLAND to receive a telegram informing him that of the 108 applicants for the two positions, he had been selected. The other job went to former lighthouse keeper, NEIL SHEPPARD. Replies that the FNP CHIEF RANGER was MURRAY SCHOFIELD.

11.10: Fifteen months later, he says he and HELEN were offered the MARRIED COUPLE'S position at POMPOLONA, which he accepted. He then handed in his resignation to the CHIEF RANGER and describes the sense of relief he felt at the time.

12.20: Goes on to say that the FNP position was the only one that left him with a sense ofjob dissatisfaction, citing bureaucracy as the main problem with it. He explains this further.

14.00: Adds that often he presented slide shows to visitors at the MOTOR CAMP and at CASCADE CREEK but was questioned about doing so by SCHOFIELD, even though it was outside of working hours and done with his own equipment. "He wanted to make it so that it was a big deal through the PARK (BOARD)."

14.20: The job as RANGER covered the entire PARK area, he affirms. He remembers spending weeks based at KNOBS FLAT while they built concrete picnic tables for PARK visitors.

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00.30: Replies that other duties as PARK RANGER involved HUT building such as the JUNCTION BURN and clearing scrub along the side of the HOLLYFORD TRACK, often by himself. Briefly mentions being involved in the government work scheme for BORSTAL BOYS who were given basic labour training skills through working on projects in the HOLLYFORD.

01.00: Complains that there was little provision for FNP staff when he started the job in TE ANAU and says that after the single men's accommodation house was built, he and HELEN moved into that while the single male staff had to carry on living in a caravan. Names some of them as MURRAY CARDNO, ALEX BUCHANAN and COLIN BUCKLEY.

01.50: Mentions that as well as the FIORDLAND NATIONAL PARK BOARD working on conservation issues in TE ANAU, there were various government agencies involved, including the FOREST SERVICE and the WILDLIFE BRANCH of the INTERNAL AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT.

02.20: [NO PUBLICATION OF THIS SECTION UNTIL AFTER 2034] Comments that all three agencies appeared to have an agenda not to work together so that it was a good thing the DEPARTMENT of CONSERVATION was formed instead (in 1987). He provides an example to illustrate his view. It concerned access for VIPs to the TAKAHE area in the MURCHISON MTS.

05-30: As mentioned earlier, he left the FNP job and with HELEN worked as HUT KEEPER at POMPOLONA on the MILFORD TRACK the following season (1964/65). Again, though, the living conditions for a married couple were inadequate, he says.

0630: They were then asked if they would take on a MANAGER' S posting at WAIKAREMOANA MOTOR CAMP during its winter season and return to POMPOLONA the next summer. By the end of the winter, he says, they'd transformed what was a miserable-looking CAMPSITE into somewhere people enjoyed staying at. "And we stayed for five years.'

07.40: The environment was not dissimilar to POMPOLONA except that they were situated on the lakeshore. During the winter, he adds, it was closed. "We were the only ones there and the CHIEF RANGER and the launch master, and the THC HOTEL - LAKEHOUSE - which was demolished later.'

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00.30: Interview resumes with him saying that they both enjoyed working at WAIKAREMOANA where they were surrounded by "the bush, the lake, lovely people, the trout fishing, the hunting, but I missed the mountains and if I could ever have been in two places at once it would've been up there and down here".

03.15: Despite being offered a RANGER'S job on an island in the HAURAKI GULF, he says he decided instead to opt for another career change which would bring him "back home to TE ANAU". So his next job (1970) was working as a DRIVER for the government-operated NEW ZEALAND RAILWAY ROAD SERVICES (NZR) on a bus service between TE ANAU and MILFORD SOUND.

03.30: Again, while he enjoyed the job, the working conditions, he says, were a problem in that it was a seven-day week. And "I wasn't getting into the PARK, which I'd come back for".

04.10. Replies that the NZR had a depot in TE ANAU which employed five DRIVERs. As well as the MILFORD run, he also worked on the service to GORE through MANAPOURI and tours to MT COOK

04.30. Mentions that he was picking up passengers from a tour group that had arrived at MANAPOURI AIRPORT where he met the AMERICAN owner (STOCKTON RUSH) of a luxury lodge (TAKARO LODGE). This led to RUSH offering him a job as PROPERTY MANAGER at TAKARO.

05.25: "But that involved everything... shoeing the HORSES, taking guests to MILFORD in the TAKARO vehicle, spraying the thistles, grading the (private) road (into "KARO)."

06.00. Mentions that it was with reluctance that he left the NZR job and his employers had offered him several incentives to stay on, such as time off, but he refused and took up the job at TAKARO instead (in 1971)

06 45: TAKARO, he says, was a going concern for six months before it "went under and I stayed on for two years looking after it until... eventually... they got a permanent caretaker".

08.05: The guests who stayed at the short-lived TAKARO LODGE, he says, were mainly wealthy AMERICANS who paid up to $200/night for the luxury accommodation.

08.55: Recalls the first time he set eyes on the place. "That building was the most amazing…the way it fitted into the landscape. Grass sod roofs, river boulders, stained weatherboards and STOCKTON was at the entrance with a steward and a waitress in their tartan." The Interior of the building was equally impressive, he says.

10-30: Considers that perhaps what attracted some to the charms of TAKARO'S river valley surroundings were exactly the same factors that discouraged others. "There was nothing to do there. Except stay in total silence. Absolute silence. No lawnmowers, no telephones...no rain on the iron (roof). Nothing.

11.20: After having worked there for a while, he says, he learned that although they were staying in luxury accommodation, many of the guests after a day at MILFORD SOUND were not keen on getting back to the LODGE too soon. "For every person that wants silence and isolation, there's a hundred it drives them nuts.'

13.00: [NO PUBLICATION OF THIS SECTION UNTIL AFTER 2034] Suggests that RUSH had managed to secure the property (2,500 acres of remote UPUKERORA VALLEY CROWN-owned land for NZ$45,000) on the false premise that he had the financial backup to invest in NEW ZEALAND, as he explains. He names some of the government ministers involved.

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00.00: [NO PUBLICATION OF THIS SECTION UNTIL AFTER 2034] Continues on the same topic (adding that SIR CHARLES UPHAM was strongly opposed to the sale of NZ freehold land to former adversaries and that his protest let to his resignation from the TAKARO LODGE BOARD of TRUSTEES)

01.30: [NO PUBLICATION OF THIS SECTION UNTIL AFTER 2034] Ultimately the blame for TAKARO'S failure rests on RUSH'S incompetence, while in the same breath he adds "I landed up...his best mate". Takes the view that RUSH was under pressure regarding his personal reputation as a businessman while at the same time he had single-handedly taken on the NZ government.

02.15: Replies that while working for RUSH, he lived at home in TE ANAU and commuted to TAKARO, bringing with him supplies or guests in the property's old LANDROVER.

02.45: To illustrate the calibre of guests that stayed at the LODGE, he says they included the leaders of large global enterprises or high-ranking officials such as the US AMBASSADOR to AUSTRALIA. Provides a colourful example of this and the type of chit-chat that ensued as he drove them from MANAPOURI AIRPORT to TAKARO.

05.00 Talks about working there after the business closed down, saying he still went in every day to air the cottages. During the winter months while RUSH was overseas, he lived on the property full-time.

05-45: Remembers the days after the place had finally been sold and all the goods and chattels had been auctioned. "Everything was stripped, and I pulled up and I looked up and I laughed. There was a carriage lamp still on the outside of the building. And I thought 'I've got a carriage lamp' (laughs).'

06-25: The auction, jointly conducted by two auctioneering firms was spread over two days and was well attended, he says, with many of the viewers from the TE ANAU BASIN. "Everybody's got a little bit of TAKARO. And it all looks so grand."

08-30: Referring back to the issue of the sale of land to RUSH, he again says the whole issue was "a disaster", adding that the AMERICAN had also planned to create a large subdivision of the 2,500 acres, thereby making millions of dollars out of the deal which had cost him only $45,000.

08.50: At that time, he continues, it was impossible for NEW ZEALANDERS to purchase freehold land in the TE ANAU BASIN (it was mostly CROWN-owned property).

10.10: Moving on, he says he took a year off from working. HELEN, meanwhile, was working at LUXMORE HOTEL, TE ANAU, and he occasionally helped out with the breakfast menus.

11.10: His next venture was working as GROUNDSMAN for the newly-built FIORDLAND COLLEGE (opened early 1976). "It wasn't a job; it was a way of life." He explains this further, adding that it was a position he retained for twenty five years until he retired in 2001.

12.15: Affirms that over the years he has been involved in several community groups and organisations. These include the FIORDLAND VOLUNTEER AMBULANCE service, set up by JOHN DONALDSON (the local pharmacist) and RON PALMER in 1969.

12.30: Both he and HELEN got involved in the service after they returned to TE ANAU (from WAIKAREMOANA) since she worked at the TE ANAU PHARMACY where it was discovered that she was a trained nurse. "She did five trips one week (to INVERCARGILL and back), that's a thousand miles.'

13.20: By then, TE ANAU had a full-time doctor, JOHN MOORE, who'd initially been contracted for staff and families of the MANAPOURI HYDRO SCHEME. But when it was completed and the HYDRO VILLAGE dismantled, one of its houses was transported from there to the site of the present TE ANAU MEDICAL CENTRE from where he operated a full-time GP clinic.

13.45: The VOLUNTEER AMBULANCE service, he says, was a very successful community group with up to twenty volunteers at any one time. "Never failed to respond quickly to a call." He also considers it was the first in NEW ZEALAND to provide three-person assistance.

14.45 Affirms that the service was more in demand than in many other parts of NZ because of the growing popularity of the FNP, along with the increase in flight activity due to tourism and the venison recovery industry of the 1960s/70s.

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Track 12 starts

00.00: Talks about the good and the bad in having the main HIGHWAYS in the district upgraded from gravel surface to tar-seal. With the former, there were far fewer road traffic accidents compared with post-upgrade conditions. "That's a result of speed."

00.50: When he started with the VOLUNTEER AMBULANCE, he says there was no training given when faced with fatal accidents. "It's easier with a dead person than one who's dying."

01.25: "We lure people to here from the four corners of the earth (via the tourism industry) but when they really need you, when they're upside down on the side of the road, there's hardly anybody interested in 'em. And I believe…that the care of those tourist visitors should be as much a part of our tourism as when they're alive and healthy and spending money."

02.00: Adds that so many lives have depended on the activities of a "handful of unpaid VOLUNTEERS" who've given up their time (averaging about six hours per incident).

03.45: Now, he continues, two full-time professional medical personnel have been recruited so that his only involvement with the VOLUNTEER AMBULANCE is in dealing with the transfer of the deceased following any type of accident. In the nine-months to SEPTEMBER 2009, there have been seven such cases. The annual average is three, he says.

04.10: A very different community activity has been his participation in the FIORDLAND PLAYERS, a local theatrical society. He has been actively involved for the past thirty years although he has gradually cut back his involvement and turned his attention to ' 'poetry gigs".

04.45: Illustrates with a couple of examples some impromptu situations on stage that he still remembers clearly.

07.25: Goes on to say that performing in PANTOMIMES or SHOWS was easy because a forgotten line could be quickly covered up. But not so the first DRAMA in which he was cast when forgetting a line was nerve-wracking. "It was a challenge."

08.10: Mentions being a member of the LONDON GANG SHOW when he was a child and recalls a co-actor became quite a success. Discovering theatrical talent, he continues, begins at the grass roots level "school productions, scout halls, the village halls".

08.40: But the emergence of satellite TV and café bars, he goes on, has led to the demise of live theatre.

09.10: Since the mid-1970s, as he explains, he has developed a keen interest in RUNNING and taking part in MARATHON events. When the KEPLER TRACK was formed in 1988, he adds, he was among the first participants in the inaugural KEPLER CHALLENGE (a MARATHON RUN round the entire 61.8km of river valley and ALPINE terrain).

10.40: Of all twenty-one annual KEPLER CHALLENGES (by DECEMBER 2009), he says he's missed only one (in 1989) and although he no longer RUNS the event, he now walks it at a fast pace. As a RUNNER, his best time was 6hrs 57mins.

11.20 In the first year of the CHALLENGE, he says, 120 RUNNERS took part. In 2009, the number has been set at a maximum of 400 entrants in a first-come-first-served online application which attracts hundreds more willing applicants.

13.15: Fifty years ago, he says, TE ANAU was a settlement of up to forty families. It had one general store, a bank which opened once a week, one café, a billiards saloon which combined as a barber's shop run by DES ARTHUR, and a straight road to MILFORD SOUND.

13.45: As changes have evolved in the town (whose permanent resident population numbers more than 3000 in 2009), he says he adopted an assertive approach (with the authorities) in trying to keep some of the "special features over this side of the lake".

14-00: Says he lives in TE ANAU because it's at the boundary to the FNP. "No bugger is gonna take it from us or deny us entry. That's our NATIONAL PARK, for visitors and us.. .that's the magic of FIORDLAND and that's why I live here."

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Track 13 starts

00.10: Replies that when he arrived at WELLINGTON in 1953, he would never have predicted what lay in store for him over the following fifty-plus years. He says that having spent his childhood in LONDON where he saw the daily grind of commuters, his life in NZ has been very different. "I haven't spent a percentage of my life commuting like successful people often do (laughs)."

02.00: States that the first home he and HELEN owned in TE ANAU was on a (quarter acre) section they bought in 1965 on MATAI STREET (NO.83) for 400 pounds, un-serviced. A further $11,000 was spent on getting a house built on the section (by FRANK FISKEN and MURRAY CARDNO). The two-storey house is still standing in 2009.

03.10: But there wasn't the peace they had experienced at WAIKAREMOANA so when the opportunity arose to buy a larger block of land on the outskirts of TE ANAU (at CHARLES NAIRN ROAD), they took it (in 1984). They paid $23,500 for the eight-acre block.

04.10: Mentions how they also had plans to establish a café/bar in the town so they bought another small section (on MOKONUI STREET) for $800. Instead of a café, though, they built a cottage/craft-shop on the site that he and HELEN ran for the next sixteen years.

05.50: Following keen interest from potential lessees to set up a café/bar, he says they borrowed $70,000 to build an extension to the cottage and it became the REDCLIFF CAFÉ, which he says has grown in popularity since it opened in the late 1990s.

06.20: Considers that on a practical level, they ought to sell the building and benefit from any profits made. But at this stage, he says, that looks unlikely even if he was offered a million dollars for it.

07-30: On the future of the town, he says that still the major stumbling block is creating a winter drawcard for tourists.

09 - 10: Mentions that his BROTHER, CHRIS, owned and operated a (SCENIC) airline company from QUEENSTOWN. Adds that in the mid-1960s CHRIS WILLETT began working as a RADIO OPERATOR at the TE ANAU airport (which was situated behind the MEDICAL CENTRE) and while there, learned to fly through the FIORDLAND AERO CLUB.

09.45 About seven years ago, he continues, his BROTHER sold the company — MILFORD SOUND SCENIC FLIGHTS - which included the FLOATPLANE that operated from the TE ANAU lakefront.

10.20: Replies that the SCENIC flights business is extremely competitive and with the additional stress caused by air accidents in such mountainous terrain "it starts to weigh on you a bit…incompetence by the pilots, which is usually the reason for crashes...he's been happy to be out of that industry"

11.10: As far as further development of the town goes, he replies that in recent years hundreds of sections have been created, many of them still lying empty possibly due to the economic climate of the late 2000s.

12.00: Referring again to the FIORDLAND winters, he says those who have lived in the area for a few years know to "hibernate" during the winter and "really go for it in the summer". Almost all the local restaurants and cafés close for those few months, he adds.

12.45: But that downtime is one of the reasons he chooses to continue living in TE ANAU, as he explains further.

Track 13 stops

Interview ends